Stainless frets will be standard on all models

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spudmunkey
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Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby spudmunkey » Wed Dec 13, 2017 4:08 pm

I was listening to the live FB video. About (I think) 59 minutes in he mentioned that stainless steel frets will be standard on all builds.

Well, that may explain at least some of the coming price increases.

Changing to other fret sizes in stainless will be free, and EVO will still be an up-charge from stainless.

I didn't catch exactly when this was starting...new year or when the nickel wire was gone. I'll try to find that segment again tonight and will update this post. If anyone else caught it, please share and I'll update this post then, too. :)

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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby rYche » Thu Dec 14, 2017 3:25 am

It's about time really. Don't know many that don't get stainless when given the option. :applause:

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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby texastoast » Thu Dec 14, 2017 4:00 am

"Well, that may explain at least some of the coming price increases. "

He did also mention that his parents had a vacation home in Hawaii. Perhaps that has something to do with increase as well.

(Sorry, class envy is all the rage now )

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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby spudmunkey » Thu Dec 14, 2017 5:44 am

If I remember right, they've had that for a couple decades.

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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby rYche » Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:34 am

He mentioned healthcare costs for his employees increasing year after year. I'd imagine that's pretty darn expensive.

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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby texastoast » Thu Dec 14, 2017 3:39 pm

spudmunkey wrote:If I remember right, they've had that for a couple decades.


I have been a customer for over three decades. Never once did I get an invite. I was just being persnickety anyway.

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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby texastoast » Thu Dec 14, 2017 3:50 pm

rYche wrote:He mentioned healthcare costs for his employees increasing year after year. I'd imagine that's pretty darn expensive.


That is a big expense anywhere. But I still wonder why anyone who manufactures would do so in California. I grew up there and understand the weather and topography are a plus. But focusing purely on the manufacturing for a profit it is not a great state. It is not the hell on earth some make it out to be. But it is harder in cost and legislation. Of course, his company was founded long before that was a factor.

However he also said in a video that he refuses to work with consultants that can streamline his process. He stated he has no interest in speeding things up. That is not exactly how it works if done right. Yes you may increase production as result. But does not have to be part of it at all. You should still wish to increase quality and reduce cost. From what I have seen from inside his factory, and what i have experienced as a customer he has a bunch of low hanging fruit that could be fixed. Price increases should also correspond with an attempt to reduce cost.Just my opinion.

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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby Koshchei » Thu Dec 14, 2017 3:59 pm

The Kiesel family has been in business longer than there have been consultants, and they seem to be doing pretty well for a company that's found its size and pace. Besides, given how long Carvin/Kiesel has been using automation, I don't think that there are any industry best practices in this day and age that Carvin didn't actually pioneer.

Also, about time on the stainless frets! :)

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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby Nombrecomun » Thu Dec 14, 2017 7:55 pm

texastoast wrote:
That is a big expense anywhere. But I still wonder why anyone who manufactures would do so in California. I grew up there and understand the weather and topography are a plus. But focusing purely on the manufacturing for a profit it is not a great state. It is not the hell on earth some make it out to be. But it is harder in cost and legislation. Of course, his company was founded long before that was a factor.


True but consider quality of life. Yes, you can move the company to southern Ohio or Montana but you wouldn't necessarily have happy employees. Not knocking those places but San Diego is a nice place to be.

It's a California company. That's part of the company's identity. Charvel has a plant somewhere there, Mesa Boogie is in Northern California. I don't know about others but they're hardly the only guitar company in this state making ends meet and then some.

It seems like demand for Kiesels is on the rise. That's good for them but with it will come the negatives as well. It will be interesting to see how they deal with those changes and still retain the company's values, quality, costs, and, most importantly, customer loyalty.

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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby 2Plus2isChicken » Thu Dec 14, 2017 10:42 pm

Personally I think the company should move to Nashville, but that's just so they'd be a 30 minute drive from my house. :mrgreen:
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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby Doctor Doug » Fri Dec 15, 2017 7:21 am

2Plus2isChicken wrote:Personally I think the company should move to Nashville, but that's just so they'd be a 30 minute drive from my house. :mrgreen:


Or Winnipeg..... :mrgreen:
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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby Quivering Wrist » Sat Dec 23, 2017 9:47 pm

I can see this happening to cut down on people sending back guitars because they wished they had stainless instead.

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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby tbonesullivan » Mon Dec 25, 2017 12:14 pm

Will N/S frets still be an option? I like the feel/sound better.

I wonder if they will finally get a low/wide stainless option. That at least would be appealing. Get some fretless wonder action going on, and not need to refret it every two months.
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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby spudmunkey » Mon Dec 25, 2017 4:33 pm

Jeff mentioned that it would be non returnable, but he didn't clarify if it was going to still be carried on-going, or if it was just while supplies last of the product they already have.

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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby DesmoBob » Thu Dec 28, 2017 4:36 pm

Doctor Doug wrote:
2Plus2isChicken wrote:Personally I think the company should move to Nashville, but that's just so they'd be a 30 minute drive from my house. :mrgreen:


Or Winnipeg..... :mrgreen:

Or Honolulu... :mrgreen:
Oh wait a minute, that won't work... :oops:

Quivering Wrist wrote:I can see this happening to cut down on people sending back guitars because they wished they had stainless instead.

:laughhard: :laughhard:

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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby UnexplodedCow » Fri Dec 29, 2017 10:06 am

texastoast wrote:"Well, that may explain at least some of the coming price increases. "

He did also mention that his parents had a vacation home in Hawaii. Perhaps that has something to do with increase as well.

(Sorry, class envy is all the rage now )


Jeff also races a highly modified car in SCCA. Where do you think KRG and KRO came from? Apparently, he's quite good, but maintaining a car like that is not cheap. http://www.turnology.com/news/jeff-kies ... -the-dyno/

tbonesullivan wrote:Will N/S frets still be an option? I like the feel/sound better.


The feel I can understand, but I've never been able to hear a single difference on an electric. Never saw an acoustic with stainless frets, and I concede that may matter, but I really think the sound part is venturing up a tributary of the Tonewood Debate River. I'd love to see someone do a controlled test, probably with composite necks for consistency, and the same wood/electronics, possibly same strings and tuners.

Outside of the quotes, that's an exciting change, as I really like the longevity and low maintenance factor of stainless frets. Wish more companies would install them as stock, or at all.
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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby Bob77 » Fri Dec 29, 2017 2:26 pm

I could go either way with SS frets. It is one of those things that are cool but not a necessity...to me at least.

"they make string bending easier" - people say. Well, so does scalloping. Great guitar players of the past did not have SS frets or scalloped fret boards and they still were able to bend strings just fine :mrgreen:

But if it comes offered as a standard option that's really cool for sure.
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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby spudmunkey » Fri Dec 29, 2017 2:38 pm

See, here's my take on that: properly-dressed and polished nickel frets, as long as they are high-quality frets to start with, can feel amazing.

The difference is: will the nickel still feel that way 6 months from now after daily use and exposure to elements? Maybe, maybe not.

The stainless, in my experience, isn't noticeably better than a fresh fretjob I did on my old Ibanez...but that Ibanez's slick feel simply didn't last more than a few weeks.

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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby tbonesullivan » Fri Dec 29, 2017 2:58 pm

I'll take a guitar with stainless frets no problem, but I guess I like the resistance of N/S when bending, which is of course the feeling of the fret being worn down. It takes getting used to, and when all of my other guitars have N/S frets, and they are keepers, getting a guitar with SS frets when I have the choice of N/S isn't really a good option.

With acoustic and classical guitars, I don't know if we'll see the current alloy for SS being used. Classical guitarists prefer a softer N/S alloy than used on electric guitars, so they probably won't go for stainless unless it can be made the same hardness.

And that hardness more than anything is why the SS frets last longer. If they were the same hardness as N/S frets, they would wear almost as fast, they just wouldn't get oxidation on them in the process.
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Re: Stainless frets will be standard on all models

Postby Bob77 » Fri Dec 29, 2017 3:33 pm

spudmunkey wrote:See, here's my take on that: properly-dressed and polished nickel frets, as long as they are high-quality frets to start with, can feel amazing.

The difference is: will the nickel still feel that way 6 months from now after daily use and exposure to elements? Maybe, maybe not.

The stainless, in my experience, isn't noticeably better than a fresh fretjob I did on my old Ibanez...but that Ibanez's slick feel simply didn't last more than a few weeks.


My take is that properly dressed and polished nickel frets are just as great. Lot of guitar players I know take short cuts when changing strings and do not polish the frets; which is so super easy and simple.

I always polish my frets with each string change...even if they don't seem like they need to be polished. Makes a huge difference.
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