The definition of insanity....

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GuitFiddle
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The definition of insanity....

Postby GuitFiddle » Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:39 pm

Darn this company. In spite of history, I occasionally still peruse here and find myself yearning for something or another. Thus, here I am again considering another build (in-stock has absolutely nothing that appeals to me).

I'm still a sucker for the CT3, and have a simple and returnable (if necessary) build in mind. Nuthin' but an orange burst and some pickup covers with a rosewood board.

We'll see if I can get over my more recent experiences and let it happen. I'll have to push aside recent-enough memories of missing control cavity covers, non-returnable 'sharpie bursts', and fret boards so poorly dried that they turned necks into bowed razor-saws in less that two weeks (hence the RW board, the only somewhat recent board I've received that stayed stable).

Wish me either the ability to learn, or good luck...I'll need one or the other.
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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby ilyti » Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:08 pm

Hey good to see you again!
FWIW I think your CS is one of the finest of the species. I'm not gonna tell you what to do, but if you do order again it may be worth mentioning in a friendly way how lucky they are to get your business again. Did you ever solve the neck issue with the DC127?

Oh and how are your Godins treating you? Well enough to you know... update your signature? 8)

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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby UnexplodedCow » Sun Mar 04, 2018 2:29 pm

Was there a thread about his DC? I don't remember seeing one.
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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby gumbynotpokey » Sun Mar 04, 2018 4:51 pm

GuitFiddle wrote:Darn this company. In spite of history, I occasionally still peruse here and find myself yearning for something or another. Thus, here I am again considering another build (in-stock has absolutely nothing that appeals to me).

I'm still a sucker for the CT3, and have a simple and returnable (if necessary) build in mind. Nuthin' but an orange burst and some pickup covers with a rosewood board.

We'll see if I can get over my more recent experiences and let it happen. I'll have to push aside recent-enough memories of missing control cavity covers, non-returnable 'sharpie bursts', and fret boards so poorly dried that they turned necks into bowed razor-saws in less that two weeks (hence the RW board, the only somewhat recent board I've received that stayed stable).

Wish me either the ability to learn, or good luck...I'll need one or the other.


...they do offer a tantalizing proposition, if nothing else.....
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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby dejabluguitar » Mon Mar 05, 2018 8:29 am

Ben, good luck with whatever you decide. fwiw I've done many builds and all have been good, but my last 3 Solos over the last year have very very good, Best guitars in 42 years of playing.
my cover band http://www.dejabluband.com

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way diffrent than my cover band
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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby GuitFiddle » Wed Mar 07, 2018 2:09 pm

Still mulling it over, I suppose I'm not on any real timeline.

The Godins have been great to me! In fact that is one of the things that makes me hesitate on a new build. I have the three-voice guitars which are their own thing, but I have the LG Signature that I bought used for $300 with a case, superficial headstock crack and big ding in the top and all. Sure, it looks like a beluga whale with a flame top, but it's a great guitar that I love to play. The CT3 wouldn't really get me anything over and above the LG. In fact, if I stayed in the Godin family there is the Core and Summit series which are outstanding....still I loves me some CT.

The beautiful DC, I'm afraid, was a loss on the balance sheet. Despite humidification, that ebony board wouldn't play ball. It shrank, developed Hameritis, and ran the guitar out of truss rod. I sold it with full disclosure, and so you can understand my hesitation on a new build...

I'll have to look into those Solos. And give ilyti's mother land some love by updating my signature one day! :laughhard:
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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby Doctor Doug » Wed Mar 07, 2018 8:36 pm

I have a Godin Summit ct. It's a great guitar. I loaded with M22s and it's even better!

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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby Jackson928 » Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:23 am

Off Topic
and fret boards so poorly dried that they turned necks into bowed razor-saws in less that two weeks


That is not a warranty issue?

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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby GuitFiddle » Fri Mar 09, 2018 6:38 am

Jackson928 wrote:
Off Topic
and fret boards so poorly dried that they turned necks into bowed razor-saws in less that two weeks


That is not a warranty issue?


Certainly, but when you've been ordering from the company for 25 years and never had that happen, then you get three in a row which do that, really what's the point? It's one thing to have a wonky piece of wood that behaves unpredictably, quite another to have a pattern during a specific time frame even across different wood species. I would have had to pay shipping back on each one, the DC would have been rebuilt (unless they decided that a straight-enough neck with no truss rod left was acceptable) and I likely would have suffered the same thing again. To be frank, I had also lost confidence in the company at that point. I have noticed as well, I'm definitely not the only one to have that happen on builds within the last couple of years. New-growth woods aren't helping matters either, but every mfg has to deal with that and most seem to be doing well enough.

Short answer, yes, but I elected to unload them and I still feel it was the right choice.
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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby brento73 » Fri Mar 09, 2018 8:49 am

GuitFiddle wrote:Wish me either the ability to learn, or good luck...I'll need one or the other.


I kind of feel like you just need regular luck, since it seems like you've been having REALLY bad luck. It's like one of those people who gets struck by lightning, and then it happens again. :shock:

A CT3 sounds like a good idea, and....

good luck!

:)

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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby UnexplodedCow » Fri Mar 09, 2018 9:44 am

GuitFiddle wrote:
Jackson928 wrote:
Off Topic
and fret boards so poorly dried that they turned necks into bowed razor-saws in less that two weeks


That is not a warranty issue?


Certainly, but when you've been ordering from the company for 25 years and never had that happen, then you get three in a row which do that, really what's the point? It's one thing to have a wonky piece of wood that behaves unpredictably, quite another to have a pattern during a specific time frame even across different wood species. I would have had to pay shipping back on each one, the DC would have been rebuilt (unless they decided that a straight-enough neck with no truss rod left was acceptable) and I likely would have suffered the same thing again. To be frank, I had also lost confidence in the company at that point. I have noticed as well, I'm definitely not the only one to have that happen on builds within the last couple of years. New-growth woods aren't helping matters either, but every mfg has to deal with that and most seem to be doing well enough.

Short answer, yes, but I elected to unload them and I still feel it was the right choice.


It certainly sounds like there was a problem at the factory. Did you ever make a thread about this? I'd love to read it.

I don't know if tree growth matters so much. If a tree 100 years ago was 24" diameter compared to now, and neither tree grew any faster, what would the difference be? I will say that I think modern trees are smaller diameter, and how that plays into the wood may be a factor; I really don't know, and I'm not even sure if anyone would.

Kiln vs. air drying is another big argument; each side citing various benefits compared to the other. Torrefied wood is becoming a thing (even Martin is doing it), and I think that may be a smart move. "Roasted" woods have their sap cooked/hardened, with even less moisture in them, then brought back to normal amounts as far as I know. Interestingly, some torrefied necks are said not to need a finish, and still have a warranty. I'd love to see Kiesel start using this.

In any situation, having 3 guitars turn out badly would forever turn me off of a brand. I've left brands of other products for far less, mostly because trying to get them to honor their warranty was a headache (taking months or years of fighting, for example). If you have trepidation about it, I'd suggest just not doing it, or maybe finding a used guitar that suits your wants; less expensive, and likely less of a risk, especially if you can try it out first without having to deal with a shipping headache.
We are entitled to our own, wrong, opinions.

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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby GuitFiddle » Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:50 pm

UXC -

Nah, never made a thread about it. That was around the time of 'the customer is always wrong' era, and I didn't think it would have been worthwhile to breach that topic, it would have just been squeaky wheel stuff - a curmudgeon yelling at kids to get off his lawn. But, as I occasionally perused this forum recently, I saw that I wasn't the only lucky recipient of this issue.

As far as new vs old growth wood....I don't think it's necessarily the wood itself that differs so much, it's that the old growth stuff was cut down en masse and has been sitting around lumber yards for decades. That stuff has stabilized, dried, weathered, aged...whatever happens to old wood. With the ever-increasing demand new growth stuff is cut and dried and used. That said they are different...Honduran mahogany as an example. It's all farm-grown now, which is good, but the wood tends to be a different color, heavier, more mineral content, etc. It still has the tell-tale signs of being Honduran mahogany...just not quite the same as it used to be. Old-growth stuff is almost impossible to find anymore.

Personally I think torrefaction is an excellent way of dealing with newer growth woods and the companies using it are ahead of the curve. In fact it helps achieve all the wonderful unidentifiable stuff that happens to old wood.

I think your advice is sound. And, I must have felt the same way...as it turns out this was over before it really began. I just pulled the trigger on a Godin Summit Classic HB to scratch the itch, this one with one of those wonderful maple tops that just have a hint of natural subtle flame in certain spots and those dark brown mineral streaks running across it in various places. Classic indeed, the kind of thing I wouldn't be able to get from Kiesel anyway. And of course I got it for about 60% of its new price.

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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby UnexplodedCow » Fri Mar 09, 2018 3:34 pm

I've heard great things about Godin, and have tried a couple years ago, but never bought any. That is a well done burst. I'm not much on the LP shape, but that guitar, specifically, is a beauty! Very much agreed about the grain. The whole package is an exercise in subtlety in a good way. I hope it brings many smiles to your face.
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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby Jackson928 » Fri Mar 09, 2018 3:53 pm

Wow, well that all sucks for sure...

What area are you in? Wonder if the dry California air then shipping to some new climate is effecting things for you? Though that happens more with air dried woods. I have brought home planks just across state lines that twisted after a new home.

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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby KH » Sat Mar 10, 2018 4:24 pm

GuitFiddle wrote:UXC -



I think your advice is sound. And, I must have felt the same way...as it turns out this was over before it really began. I just pulled the trigger on a Godin Summit Classic HB to scratch the itch, this one with one of those wonderful maple tops that just have a hint of natural subtle flame in certain spots and those dark brown mineral streaks running across it in various places. Classic indeed, the kind of thing I wouldn't be able to get from Kiesel anyway. And of course I got it for about 60% of its new price.

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I've been curious about the Summits, as well.
Be sure to post a review of it when you get it, GuitFiddle.

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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby GuitFiddle » Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:02 am

Jackson928 wrote:Wow, well that all sucks for sure...

What area are you in? Wonder if the dry California air then shipping to some new climate is effecting things for you? Though that happens more with air dried woods. I have brought home planks just across state lines that twisted after a new home.


I live on the Colorado Front Range. Freakishly dry and notoriously murderous on guitars, yet I never experienced anything even close to this before. It should be noted that the other reports I've seen which noted problems of this degree were also on the Front Range, and also a few in Utah. The mystery was that none of the previous guitars I bought from the company (20+) experienced this problem, and related problems from other mfgs (when they were experienced) were never this extreme. Whatever the specific reason, this is what caused me to lose confidence. It also prompted me to propose alternative board materials like Richlite in the Product Suggestions forum, which was generally received about as well as a beer-and-chili fart in a crowded elevator.
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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby GuitFiddle » Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:05 am

KH wrote:I've been curious about the Summits, as well.
Be sure to post a review of it when you get it, GuitFiddle.


10-4 Kent, keep an eye on the Other Gear section.

Strange question, but...do you still have a Diodati? I always thought those were pretty cool.
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Re: The definition of insanity....

Postby KH » Sun May 27, 2018 4:04 am

GuitFiddle wrote:
KH wrote:I've been curious about the Summits, as well.
Be sure to post a review of it when you get it, GuitFiddle.


10-4 Kent, keep an eye on the Other Gear section.

Strange question, but...do you still have a Diodati? I always thought those were pretty cool.


Sorry, only a 2 month late reply. Shows how much I get over here these days. :laughhard:
Yep, I still have my two Diodati guitars. Seems like the company started up again. But, I don't believe the new guitars are MIJ anymore.
https://www.facebook.com/Diodati-Guitar ... 401448122/


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