Re: Kiesel virgin asking for some tips on a Zeus Z6 build?
Posted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 9:46 am
katerlouis wrote:Oh– yeah, Tosins set also has a third voicing indeed. But.. does that mean when Tosin calls position 4 a coil split of the two inner coils, in reality this is just voice 3 of both pickups combined?
Each of the Tosin pickups has a different voice 3. Position 4 (if the neck is 1 and bridge is 5) is both inner coils running through the more stratty-voiced bridge voice 3 preamp. Position 2 is the neck's outer coil running through the neck voice 3 preamp.
One last try to sum up my general confusion with the terminology:
on the strandberg normal modern fluence set, push pull on tone knob changes between voice 1 and 2
and push pull on the volume knob splits the currently selected voicing. Resulting in 4 different combinations per pickup-combination (voice 1 full, voice 1 split, voice 2 full, voice 2 split) –
Now on the KSE or Tosin set, could voice 1 and 2 get splitted or is it intended that voice 3 replaces the "manual coilsplit" – Or is voice 3 just intended to be splitted and could hypothetically used as a humbucker?
What is correct:
a) v1 full, v1 split, v2 full, v2 split, v3 full, v3 split possible on each pickup combionation
b) or v1 full, v2 full, v3 coilsplit on each pickup combination?
According to this wiring plan https://www.fishman.com/wp-content/uplo ... Switch.pdf – it looks like b) is the case?
What confuses there again, though, is that voice 3 uses the inner neck coil on position 2, whereas on position 4 the OUTER neck coil is used–
B is right: you can get any combo of splitting and voice you want, but they're intended to work best as V1/2 humbucker, V3 split.
The Tosin wiring is kinda specific because of his neck pickup - it's actually one Fender-style coil with magnet pole pieces (the outer one) and one coil with a blade magnet pole piece (the inner one). This is because he wanted the neck's voice 3 to be pretty accurate to (if I recall correctly) the neck pickup on a Tele he had, but still wanted the split blades sound.
Sorry if this all seems trivial to you guys– but this confusion bugs me and I just need to understand this
Nah you're good. No worries.
Now to my concerns of the bridge sounds.
What do you say to me being scared of the "too metally" sound of the KSE bridge pickup? How exactly does the Tosin bridge differ from the KSE bridge?
Why I ask these questions? I'm thinking a KSE in the neck and Tosin in the bridge – BOOM!
The thing is, the demos I saw from the KSE pickups didn't kick me on the bridge; from what I heard of Tosins neck pickup, it's probably spanky enough for me?
I don't think you have to be scared of it. It's all a matter of fine tuning your full rig. Are they metal? Hell yeah. But so's a Duncan Jazz set if you play it right.
The Tosin bridge, in voice 1, is (imo) like a Bare Knuckle Blackhawk kinda vibe: pretty compressed, sounds massive, and really hot. Voice 2 is more like a Duncan Pegasus (which iirc is what he was using when he was with Duncan, after leaving Dimarzio but before hooking up with Fishman). It's warmer, lower output, super clear, and much more open. Voice 3 is sort of a modern stratty kinda vibe.
The KSE bridge, in voice 1, is like an EMG 85. It's less hot and full than the Tosin, and a little warmer on the high end. Voice 2 is like a Duncan Custom or Distortion, in that it's not as hot, less compressed, and a little more organic feeling, but also a little more aggressive if you play it harder. Voice 3 is (again) sorta modern strat vibes.
I mean, .. I don't think this sounds great
This voice 3 is significantly quieter than the other voicings, which I assume is normal when you split the coils, but Tosin Abasi says his pickups balance that out. And I also think this sounds kinda thin, don't you?
here aswell.. bridge voice 2, meeeh?
IMO Ken has issues dialing in a tone that isn't super bright and metallic. Even when the NAMM demos he did of the Classics sounds like this. See if you can find a Caparison dealer near you, they do signatures for both of the KSE guys that come with these pickups. There's nothing out there with the Tosin pickups that you could try, but Arnold Plays Guitar did a shootout between the Moderns, Steph Carpenter set, and the Tosin set that you could look at for reference. Just to warn you though: if you think the KSE set is thin, get ready for the Tosin set: they're prog and djent pickups through and through.
From what I heard so far the Tosin demo had really great split neck sounds– But of course, these are youtube demos I listen to on earbuds. They maybe use amps I don't like, or something gets lost in their record process, or the cabs aren't to my liking. This is why I need advice people who actually played them. Only comparison I have is the modern fluence, and they didn't quite resonate with me so far, although I probably just suck at dialing in tone.
I mean if you really messed with it you could probably make them work for you, but sometimes stuff just doesn't work for what you want. Don't sweat it - it's why we have so many options.
I can tell you from my (limited) time with the KSEs in the Joel Stroetzel sig that they actually do jazz and pop-punk as well as riffy metalcore and fusiony prog.
(Maybe that's a good opportunity to tell you guys that I'm using a Line6 Helix with AKG K240 Mark II headphones at home–)
Oh awesome! Don't worry about pickups being too hot, then - the input pad's there for a reason.
Now the most important question! (irony)
The fluence pickups come in gold aswell; does the KSE / Tosin sets ?
Sadly, no. The Tosins come in chrome, but the KSE is only black.
General question: how big is the tonal difference between the outer or single coil on a coil split in a neck for example? The wiring plan suggests you can have both, which means: I have to decide which one I want .
Eh the difference is nothing you couldn't compensate for with one notch on the tone knob. On the Tosins it matters because of the different construction of the neck pickup, and some pickups are wound asymmetrically so one coil will be a little hotter.
Well– theres still a huge gap between not being an asshole and being as understanding and helpfull as you guys are!
Aww thanks buddy