Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Discussion About Other Gear Brands

Moderators: Kevio, ElfDude, JesseM, RockCrue, soundchick, ChrisH, peb, Mike Jones, Bundy

User avatar
Doctor Turn
Platinum Carvinite
Platinum Carvinite
Posts: 4330
Joined: Aug 2015
Location: NYC, sans rock clubs and 48th St.
Links/Contact:

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Turn » Fri Mar 24, 2017 8:53 am

ElfDude wrote:
Doctor Turn wrote:I love the olive drab Carvin strap holding it up. Elf--how much would you say that MM weighs?



I haven't weighed it but it's very light due to the thinner body (same body and woods as the Les Paul Less and the Les Paul Custom Lite).

And I'm seriously thinking about changing out the bridge P-90 for a mini-humbucker... :think:


Sounds like you're going for a Melody Maker incarnation of Neil's Old Black--P90 in the neck and a firebird mini HB @ bridge position.

I can't knock it--it's a great sound. Both of Neil's switching positions (plus he can bypass his pots completely w/a switch throw IIRC, old incarnation of a blow switch) are sublime and it's all based on those pups. SO many classic songs/solos riffed on one of those two pickups.

The way I wound up on my triple P90 hunt had a LOT to do with my love of the Non Reverse Firebird Studio w the set neck and 3 P90's. But my love for the N-Rev Firebird began with a viewing of this for the first time:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrchpTdAV78

The tone that he's pulling from those mini humbuckers pulled me in immediately--just like so many of Neil's solos (I find Young still--to this day--one of the more interesting soloists to play in the world of rock, he sounds like no one else and he's so expressive.. and his tone from his P90 in the neck and the firebird HB in the bridge play a HUGE part in that), Winwood's solo is dripping with great, gloomy vintage tone. The sound pouring out of that old green Firebird is just goddam sublime.. it was from threading through a million non-reverse Firebird videos that the P90 editions (Studio) kept popping into my searches for more examples of the guitar... and it put me so deep into P90 love that everything else went on hold. I had to have a triple P90 axe like the Firebird Studio I could never find--at least not at that point. That's when I learned Hagstrom was back in business. The rest is (boring unimportant) history.

GuitFiddle wrote:Ain't that the truth. Honestly it's a little spooky playing an LPJ or Tele or Strat model through a different guitar because it is dead silent, as in zero noise floor. It's actually the hardest thing to get used to, you expect that hum and buzz and none is there!


It's hugely important. I find that stacks like the much maligned P100's designed to emulate P90's but cancel the hum by shoving another single coil underneath.. they lose that classic quality that a true P90 has.. slightly smothered yet beautifully compressed sound that opens up so terrifically when pushed.

Who knew Satch not only plays/played a P90 loaded axe, but has a signature guitar with them (linnk embedded).
Carvin Weaponry:
1985 DC150K (koa) Stereo, M22N/M22SD w/black hardware.
1985 100 Watt X Amp 2 x 12 combo (XV212) upgraded w/ 2 Vintage 30's
...and other gear.

https://soundcloud.com/the_heavy_clouds

User avatar
Doctor Turn
Platinum Carvinite
Platinum Carvinite
Posts: 4330
Joined: Aug 2015
Location: NYC, sans rock clubs and 48th St.
Links/Contact:

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Turn » Fri Mar 24, 2017 10:46 am

Image
Carvin Weaponry:
1985 DC150K (koa) Stereo, M22N/M22SD w/black hardware.
1985 100 Watt X Amp 2 x 12 combo (XV212) upgraded w/ 2 Vintage 30's
...and other gear.

https://soundcloud.com/the_heavy_clouds

User avatar
ElfDude
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 10467
Joined: Jan 2007
Location: In and around the lake

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby ElfDude » Fri Mar 24, 2017 9:21 pm

Yeah... like that. :)

Thinking about it...
Aries A6H, SH445, Contour 66, AE185, DC135, CT4M, Bolt, SH225, LB76F, Nomad, VT16 Head, V410, Pro Bass 100
Midlife Crisis on Facebook
The Tri-Chevys on Facebook

User avatar
ilyti
Carvinite
Carvinite
Posts: 563
Joined: Dec 2009
Location: Iqaluit, NU

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby ilyti » Sat Mar 25, 2017 11:08 am

You guys are giving me so much P90 gas, I can't take it. I just don't have a guitar to put them in. So I ordered some untrooooo 'bucker sized ones to see if they click with my playing style. I always loved the sound, but been on the fence about the look of big soapbars/dogears. Gonna try 'em in the Gibson first methinks.

...then maybe in the strat. :think:

User avatar
ElfDude
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 10467
Joined: Jan 2007
Location: In and around the lake

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby ElfDude » Sat Mar 25, 2017 8:20 pm

ilyti wrote:You guys are giving me so much P90 gas, I can't take it. I just don't have a guitar to put them in. So I ordered some untrooooo 'bucker sized ones to see if they click with my playing style. I always loved the sound, but been on the fence about the look of big soapbars/dogears. Gonna try 'em in the Gibson first methinks.

...then maybe in the strat. :think:


Untroooo? Which brand did you order?

:hijack:

Sorry to have hijacked your thread, Doctor, but Ima share something I just experienced. When I play guitars in my basement I'm often doing A - B comparisons. Tonight I tried playing these two guitars back and forth. CT4M and the Les Paul Melody Maker. Each has a hog body with a carved maple top and a set neck. In the CT I have Lithium pickups, but for this test I coil-split them and never put them into humbcuking mode, thus trying to see how their single-coilness sounded against a pair of Gibson P-90s.

Image
Image

I was blown away at how similar they sounded to each other, neck and bridge, both in tone and output. It was like, "Dang. If you want the P-90 sound in your Carvin/Kiesel, just get the Litiums and split them. You're basically there!
Aries A6H, SH445, Contour 66, AE185, DC135, CT4M, Bolt, SH225, LB76F, Nomad, VT16 Head, V410, Pro Bass 100
Midlife Crisis on Facebook
The Tri-Chevys on Facebook

User avatar
Doctor Turn
Platinum Carvinite
Platinum Carvinite
Posts: 4330
Joined: Aug 2015
Location: NYC, sans rock clubs and 48th St.
Links/Contact:

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Turn » Sun Mar 26, 2017 7:56 am

Audio or it didn't happen!

(Ducks for cover)

Actually I can believe they get into that region of sound. My ancient M22 neck pickup when split gets over into that zone... Doesn't quite replicate it exactly, but it gets into the ballpark. What it doesn't have is that throaty sound unique to all legit P90s, where something from the hi/hi mid zone is being muffled somewhat.

Do your Lithiums when split sound like Flecks? If I remember correct the bridge is split at 1:49 and the neck at around 2:20. https://youtu.be/m-fsQHj-JYE

She doesn't sound like a Special or a Gold Top to me.... Far too much presence and none of the girth... :think:
Carvin Weaponry:
1985 DC150K (koa) Stereo, M22N/M22SD w/black hardware.
1985 100 Watt X Amp 2 x 12 combo (XV212) upgraded w/ 2 Vintage 30's
...and other gear.

https://soundcloud.com/the_heavy_clouds

User avatar
ElfDude
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 10467
Joined: Jan 2007
Location: In and around the lake

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby ElfDude » Sun Mar 26, 2017 12:00 pm

Doctor Turn wrote:Audio or it didn't happen!



Good idea. I'll see if I can't throw something together this week.
Aries A6H, SH445, Contour 66, AE185, DC135, CT4M, Bolt, SH225, LB76F, Nomad, VT16 Head, V410, Pro Bass 100
Midlife Crisis on Facebook
The Tri-Chevys on Facebook

User avatar
Doctor Turn
Platinum Carvinite
Platinum Carvinite
Posts: 4330
Joined: Aug 2015
Location: NYC, sans rock clubs and 48th St.
Links/Contact:

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Turn » Sat Apr 01, 2017 11:45 am

Slab bodied, stubby heaven in 24.75" while recording on a Saturday afternoon

Image
Carvin Weaponry:
1985 DC150K (koa) Stereo, M22N/M22SD w/black hardware.
1985 100 Watt X Amp 2 x 12 combo (XV212) upgraded w/ 2 Vintage 30's
...and other gear.

https://soundcloud.com/the_heavy_clouds

User avatar
Doctor Doug
Gold Carvinite
Gold Carvinite
Posts: 1326
Joined: Oct 2013

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Doug » Sun Apr 02, 2017 12:53 am

Doctor Turn wrote:Slab bodied, stubby heaven in 24.75" while recording on a Saturday afternoon

Image


Thanks. Now I have to change my gitch.

User avatar
Doctor Turn
Platinum Carvinite
Platinum Carvinite
Posts: 4330
Joined: Aug 2015
Location: NYC, sans rock clubs and 48th St.
Links/Contact:

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Turn » Mon Apr 03, 2017 9:19 am

I learned a cool new Canadian slang term this past weekend: gitch.

Thanks, my fellow doctorate in music 8)
Carvin Weaponry:
1985 DC150K (koa) Stereo, M22N/M22SD w/black hardware.
1985 100 Watt X Amp 2 x 12 combo (XV212) upgraded w/ 2 Vintage 30's
...and other gear.

https://soundcloud.com/the_heavy_clouds

User avatar
Doctor Doug
Gold Carvinite
Gold Carvinite
Posts: 1326
Joined: Oct 2013

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Doug » Mon Apr 03, 2017 10:57 am

Doctor Turn wrote:I learned a cool new Canadian slang term this past weekend: gitch.

Thanks, my fellow doctorate in music 8)


Hahaha, you're very welcome!

I wasn't aware that it was a Canadian thing. :mrgreen:

User avatar
Doctor Turn
Platinum Carvinite
Platinum Carvinite
Posts: 4330
Joined: Aug 2015
Location: NYC, sans rock clubs and 48th St.
Links/Contact:

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Turn » Mon Apr 03, 2017 12:28 pm

When I looked it up, Hockey and Canada seemed to be the big sources on the slang. I had never heard it before--even here in the "overslanged" Bronx NYC!

I found this amusing online poll on CBC radio:

The official Canadian name for male underwear should be: (Poll Closed)
Gitch 17.34% (64 votes)


Gotch 20.33% (75 votes)


Ginch 24.12% (89 votes)


Gonch 33.60% (124 votes)


Biggie-boys 5% (17 votes)



The Wikitionary entry for Gitch comes out of their section for "Canadian English":

(Saskatchewan) Women's or men's underwear.


You never know with slang, but since I never heard it before I had to look it up--seems like Canada/Hockey is all over this word!

I was going to say it's just a matter of time before a Canadian band names themselves Gitch... but before posting I did a quick search and lo and behold--

Gitch:

GITCH!! is 4 of Winnipeg's top musicians: Murray Pulver, Joey Landreth, Paul Yee and Emmet VanEtten. We play sundays at Maws Eatery and Beer Hall!
Carvin Weaponry:
1985 DC150K (koa) Stereo, M22N/M22SD w/black hardware.
1985 100 Watt X Amp 2 x 12 combo (XV212) upgraded w/ 2 Vintage 30's
...and other gear.

https://soundcloud.com/the_heavy_clouds

User avatar
Doctor Doug
Gold Carvinite
Gold Carvinite
Posts: 1326
Joined: Oct 2013

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Doug » Tue Apr 04, 2017 7:55 am

Doctor Turn wrote:I was going to say it's just a matter of time before a Canadian band names themselves Gitch... but before posting I did a quick search and lo and behold--

Gitch:

GITCH!! is 4 of Winnipeg's top musicians: Murray Pulver, Joey Landreth, Paul Yee and Emmet VanEtten. We play sundays at Maws Eatery and Beer Hall!


That's hilarious! I actually taught Murray Pulver's son when he was in grade 2. The guy is a great guitar player! I never knew he was in a band called Gitch though.

User avatar
Doctor Turn
Platinum Carvinite
Platinum Carvinite
Posts: 4330
Joined: Aug 2015
Location: NYC, sans rock clubs and 48th St.
Links/Contact:

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Turn » Tue Apr 04, 2017 8:20 am

Way cool!
Carvin Weaponry:
1985 DC150K (koa) Stereo, M22N/M22SD w/black hardware.
1985 100 Watt X Amp 2 x 12 combo (XV212) upgraded w/ 2 Vintage 30's
...and other gear.

https://soundcloud.com/the_heavy_clouds

User avatar
Doctor Turn
Platinum Carvinite
Platinum Carvinite
Posts: 4330
Joined: Aug 2015
Location: NYC, sans rock clubs and 48th St.
Links/Contact:

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Turn » Tue May 02, 2017 4:43 pm

Someone on the board had said something along the lines of thinking of P90's as an outdated sound that nobody uses anymore, and he didn't know of anyone in his lifetime who used P90's. That was corrected right after the post, but this is a really good illustration about the high similarity between P90's and the bucker. Sure it's Bonamassa, but the player and your taste for him is irrelevant. Listen to the similarity between a Lester Paulus with P90's and with humbuckers:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1EMthKg3OE
Carvin Weaponry:
1985 DC150K (koa) Stereo, M22N/M22SD w/black hardware.
1985 100 Watt X Amp 2 x 12 combo (XV212) upgraded w/ 2 Vintage 30's
...and other gear.

https://soundcloud.com/the_heavy_clouds

Cynical
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 421
Joined: Dec 2015

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Cynical » Wed May 03, 2017 5:57 am

They sound similar with mostly clean tones, but what happens at mid-to-high gain? With there being that much of an output difference, there's no way they're going to hit the front end of an amp the same way.

User avatar
Doctor Turn
Platinum Carvinite
Platinum Carvinite
Posts: 4330
Joined: Aug 2015
Location: NYC, sans rock clubs and 48th St.
Links/Contact:

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Turn » Wed May 03, 2017 10:51 am

There's not that much of an output difference. Despite the additional coil, PAFs and P90s hit amps in the same general theater of output. Since we know if course that one PAF can be wound with a completely different number of turns versus the next, and they have wildly varying resistance measurements from 7 to just shy of 9k ohms, it's tough to even pin down a paf vs a ninety..

Now if you're talking something like a super retardo Bare Knuckle ceramic at the outer reaches of output, that's a different story, and not within the bounds of this comparison. Seth Lover wasn't​ looking to produce a whole new pickup from the P90, which he quite liked.. he was looking to maintain the profile of the p90 but quiet down the hum. It's well established fact.
Carvin Weaponry:
1985 DC150K (koa) Stereo, M22N/M22SD w/black hardware.
1985 100 Watt X Amp 2 x 12 combo (XV212) upgraded w/ 2 Vintage 30's
...and other gear.

https://soundcloud.com/the_heavy_clouds

User avatar
Naked Ape
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 434
Joined: Sep 2015

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Naked Ape » Wed May 03, 2017 3:26 pm

I just love that Joe is cranking the amp in his Hotel room. That's great. And "oh, I just picked up this '59 LP from Gruhn". So casual......must be nice! 8) Go Joe!
I definitely see potential for a P-90 resurgence. Kind of like Bell bottoms, Afro's, and Big sunglasses. I'm already GASing for a P-90 guitar. I just keep getting distracted by other guitars that pop up. You know the feeling Doc. :wink:

User avatar
Doctor Turn
Platinum Carvinite
Platinum Carvinite
Posts: 4330
Joined: Aug 2015
Location: NYC, sans rock clubs and 48th St.
Links/Contact:

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Turn » Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:39 pm

Since Protophukker has nuked my pics, I've scooped my pics from the day I rec'd it in the office/got it home onto cube, just to put some content of it in my hands. I love this guitar.

I've since top wrapped the stop bar for a little extra dose of slink and spank.

Image

With its Hagstrom sister (which is less like a Special than a pre-57 Custom):
Image
Image
Image
Image

This Special reminds me of my 150 with that light colored chunk of wood out at the edge that looks like you could crack it right off. (Although this may be dif from the 150 in that the 2 pcs of the slab may be asymmetrical and joined there, one big piece and one little piece out at the edge contour).
Carvin Weaponry:
1985 DC150K (koa) Stereo, M22N/M22SD w/black hardware.
1985 100 Watt X Amp 2 x 12 combo (XV212) upgraded w/ 2 Vintage 30's
...and other gear.

https://soundcloud.com/the_heavy_clouds

User avatar
Doctor Turn
Platinum Carvinite
Platinum Carvinite
Posts: 4330
Joined: Aug 2015
Location: NYC, sans rock clubs and 48th St.
Links/Contact:

Re: Unique Les Paul Special ("Jr. Special Exclusive) coming in..

Postby Doctor Turn » Tue Sep 05, 2017 9:13 am

Great article from Vintage Guitar Magazine on the history of the Gibson Les Paul Special, when it appeared and how it sits and did typically sit back in the 1950's versus the rest of the line;

http://www.vintageguitar.com/3223/the-g ... l-special/

Interesting factoid about the heritage Cherry color of my Special: during the period following 1957 and the introduction of the bucker by Seth Lover, sales were dipping, and this includes the Specials and the Juniors, which retained the P90's while the Standard and the Custom were given the PAF's.

Despite the upgrade to humbuckers on higher-priced Les Pauls, sales for all four models were dropping steadily. In mid 1958, the Junior got a makeover with a double-cutaway body, along with an optional Cherry Red stain finish that resulted in almost double the sales figures. In ’59, the Special got the same treatment with the same results; shipments jumped from 958 in ’58 to 1,821 in ’59.


Also interesting, which some may know already, but always baffled me... before the 1961 shape of the LP going to what became known in a couple years as the SG... in 1959 the LP Special dubcut was simply called the SG Special:
Then, in late ’59, for no apparent reason, the Les Paul Special became the SG Special. For all practical purposes it was the same guitar, with the same double-cutaway body and the same features except for the lack of the “Les Paul” silkscreen on the peghead and a slightly different pickguard.


So technically the first guitar called the SG by Gibson came out in 1959 as Gibson deleted the name Les Paul from the LP Special DC (presumably because it didn't resemble the LP in shape), but the name Les Paul wasn't removed (at LP's request because he hated the guitar's look) from the "1961 new shape" that became known as the SG, until 1963.

Another interesting factoid: obviously the Special fills the gap between a Junior and a Standard by adding the neck pickup, but they share the quality of being a straight slabbed Les Paul before a maple cap is added, and just stopping there without the maple. That extra pup was added in '55, creating the Special in the line. But did you ever notice Les himself always played a guitar that was just a fine finished slab of mahogany, like the Recording Series/Professional Series for his personal guitar? That's because--

As it turned out, not everyone liked the curvature of the top on the goldtop and the Custom (Les Paul himself was among those players who preferred a flat top), not to mention the extra weight that the maple top cap added to the goldtop and Custom. The only disadvantage to the Junior was its lack of versatility as a result of having only a single pickup.

In 1955, Gibson filled in what was becoming a gaping niche between the Junior and the goldtop with the Les Paul Special.


So lovers of the Special and the Junior are not alone in loving the lightweight, unhindered scream of uncapped wood!
Carvin Weaponry:
1985 DC150K (koa) Stereo, M22N/M22SD w/black hardware.
1985 100 Watt X Amp 2 x 12 combo (XV212) upgraded w/ 2 Vintage 30's
...and other gear.

https://soundcloud.com/the_heavy_clouds


Return to Other Gear

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests