New to Kiesel, just ordered a CS3

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wickid
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Re: New to Kiesel, just ordered a CS3

Postby wickid » Thu Jul 19, 2018 8:46 am

Doctor Turn wrote:
protovack wrote: The beryllium pickups are hot, and have very strong attack with crystal clear string definition and a thick, meaty tone. I had to turn down my gain settings


Interesting that you say that, because they are much softer, Alnico II mags with a low DC resistance (I'm pretty sure the numbers were below 7k ohms down in the sixes)--the whole idea being these pickups are a throwback to the vintage, PAF-ish humbuckers of yore, ie completely opposite the more modern (read "hot") Lithiums and Thoriums.

But what's nice about lower output pickups, and especially Alnico II (and III) pickups (which I've been leaning quite a bit on lately) is the fact that the strings vibrate much more freely from the reduced mag pull on the strings. Which opens up the whole realm of harmonics that much more--they really scream and build up when you're really pushing your overdrive.

In any case, it's great that you like the axe so much. ....


That report threw me a bit as well. But I do have Duncan CCs which are A2s (or just Customs, whichever has the A2, I have both), and they are not weak at all either IMO. :think:
(I was also wondering if he got Thoriums instead?? :think: )
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Re: New to Kiesel, just ordered a CS3

Postby spudmunkey » Thu Jul 19, 2018 11:00 am

wickid wrote:(I was also wondering if he got Thoriums instead?? :think: )


My first thought was maybe they were Lithium, but the screws don't match.

Lithium: One row of non-adjustable "slugs" and one row of Torx
Beryllium: One row of non-adjustable "slugs" and one row of flat-head screws
Thorium: Two rows of Torx screws

:think:

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Re: New to Kiesel, just ordered a CS3

Postby wickid » Thu Jul 19, 2018 1:11 pm

spudmunkey wrote:
wickid wrote:(I was also wondering if he got Thoriums instead?? :think: )


My first thought was maybe they were Lithium, but the screws don't match.

Lithium: One row of non-adjustable "slugs" and one row of Torx
Beryllium: One row of non-adjustable "slugs" and one row of flat-head screws
Thorium: Two rows of Torx screws

:think:


Beryls it is then. Just the report on the output made me wonder.
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Re: New to Kiesel, just ordered a CS3

Postby protovack » Sat Jul 21, 2018 11:09 pm

About the output of the pickups--I think I may be very used to my PRS vintage pickups which are most definitely not as hot as the beryllium. I can't imagine what the lithiums would be like then. I think this is a matter of context. To my ear, these pickups are hotter, and have a lot more clarity than most actual vintage pickups I've heard. Which may in fact be a good thing.

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Re: New to Kiesel, just ordered a CS3

Postby wickid » Mon Jul 23, 2018 7:31 am

protovack wrote:About the output of the pickups--I think I may be very used to my PRS vintage pickups which are most definitely not as hot as the beryllium. I can't imagine what the lithiums would be like then. I think this is a matter of context. To my ear, these pickups are hotter, and have a lot more clarity than most actual vintage pickups I've heard. Which may in fact be a good thing.


That may be it, and what I was thinking. Carvin/Kiesel p/ups are like that, generally. Even their "medium" output p/ups (M22T) deliver quite well.
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Doctor Turn
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Re: New to Kiesel, just ordered a CS3

Postby Doctor Turn » Mon Jul 23, 2018 3:45 pm

wickid wrote:
protovack wrote:About the output of the pickups--I think I may be very used to my PRS vintage pickups which are most definitely not as hot as the beryllium. I can't imagine what the lithiums would be like then. I think this is a matter of context. To my ear, these pickups are hotter, and have a lot more clarity than most actual vintage pickups I've heard. Which may in fact be a good thing.


That may be it, and what I was thinking. Carvin/Kiesel p/ups are like that, generally. Even their "medium" output p/ups (M22T) deliver quite well.

Those T's aren't super hot, but they're not your typical PAF either. Their setup puts them close to the 22SD, but just not with that whomping sizzle with the EQ profile.
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Re: New to Kiesel, just ordered a CS3

Postby robertkoa » Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:53 am

protovack wrote:Here is my detailed review of the guitar. Thanks for the comments, I was going for a minimalist build, a no frills versatile players guitar. What was I expecting? I really love 70's era Santana ala Moonflower, when he played Les Pauls and then the Yamaha SG. I was aiming for a guitar that could do that, something with vintage voiced pickups and smooth lead tone.
My main guitar that I play right now is a korina PRS Santana III with vintage bass and HFS pickups run through a Mesa Mark 1 re-issue head to a Stagecraft Elite cabinet with Tone Tubby alnico red speakers, and that's the rig I am testing through.

Did the guitar meet my expectations? Absolutely. But not quite in the way I thought it would. The first thing I'll say is that this guitar has a VERY full, punchy tone. It caught me off guard at first. The beryllium pickups, in combination with the tung oiled mahogany and walnut with the ebony fretboard, its really quite amazing. It has an almost acoustic guitar like vibe to it--I think the ebony board is partly responsible for that, and then the string through body design, it resonates well. But it is tight and punchy. The pickups are hot, and have very strong attack with crystal clear string definition and a thick, meaty tone. I had to turn down my gain settings significantly and be very careful with the tone controls. But once in the sweet spot, it excels at basically everything. Hard hitting power chords, lead work, controlling gain with the volume knob, it delivers on every point. However I will say that you need to be very fine with your pick attack. These pickups reward LIGHT picking and you can get some nasty overtones if you pick too hard, especially on higher gain settings. I needed to turn down my gain a LOT to get a good sound. But when you do, its incredible how much definition remains. These pickups could be described in a myriad of ways, but they will never be called muddy.

The neck was an adjustment for me. Coming from the PRS santana, which has a very meaty, round neck profile with the gloss finish that is a bit tacky from wear, it is a very easy neck to play on and hold notes, bends, etc. The Kiesel's neck feels like a thin board at first (I got the standard 14" radius). It is tung oiled and very slick at first, so my first impression was that it was tough to hold chord formations and individual lead notes due to sliding around everywhere, and the neck has quite a thin profile so I felt like I had nothing to grab on to. I'm getting used to it though. Its probably a better neck for all around playing anyway. It enables very easy transitions, slides, and the intonation is dead on. It's definitely stiffer than my PRS. The fretwork is flawless. The inlay work, flawless. I won't say I like it better, it's just different and definitely a great neck. I think my next Kiesel I will go for a 12" or even a 10" radius.

I kind of wish the edge of the body where I hold my forearm had a bevel. Other than that, there's not a thing I would change about the guitar. It has a gorgeous tone characterized by a thick, full body and responsive pick attack with exceptional definition and clarity. There is nothing mechanical about it, however it rewards good technique, and punishes sloppy playing. It doesn't tolerate high gain very well. The berylliums don't like it. At least with my setup.

So can I nail 70's Santana tones on this thing? Yep, absolutely, and a lot more. I'm glad I bought it. I was skeptical, this being my first Kiesel build, but I'm pleasantly surprised. This is a high quality instrument that in my mind is worth much more than the $1500 I paid for it.



The slight stiffness despite long mathematical discussions usually comes from string through body meaning more string is under tension.

People who have a Stoptail and string thru who bend notes with sensitivity should confirm..

One thing most people don't try regarding hotter input is to try pickups a bit lower...you might like it.

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Doctor Turn
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Re: New to Kiesel, just ordered a CS3

Postby Doctor Turn » Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:47 am

These pups must have a lot of turns, since these are AII and have a classic sub 8K DCR.

That's why I love underwound PAF's.
Carvin Weaponry:
1985 DC150K (koa) Stereo, M22N/M22SD w/black hardware.
1985 100 Watt X Amp 2 x 12 combo (XV212) upgraded w/ 2 Vintage 30's
...and other gear.

https://soundcloud.com/the_heavy_clouds


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