Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

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spudmunkey
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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby spudmunkey » Wed Nov 29, 2017 9:39 pm

CS6, quilted maple top, bright trans red finish, same red-finished dark mahogany body, white painted binding. Ebony board, MOP blocks, S bridge, all black hardware, but chrome pickups.

*sigh*

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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby Toptube » Thu Nov 30, 2017 5:27 am

Casual Madman wrote:The problem with the BBS - with all of them, anymore, really - is that it's such a limited group. Without actually running through the last week or month worth of posts, I'd guesstimate that 95% of the posts here are made by about a dozen users. I might even be overstating the number of regulars.

The folks here are wonderful, thoughtful, helpful, and a pleasure to converse with - but they're a really small subset of Carvin/Kiesel owners.

As with Walmart and local "general stores," Facebook has pretty much written the death notice of web forums.


Ehh, not really. For any given hobby or core interest, there are at least 2 fairly large forum communities on the internet. Many subjects have more than two decent forums. And then you have Reddit and all of its Subreddits, which adds another forum community for virtually any given thing.
Facebook didn't actually foster public communities as an exclusive gathering place. Forums never died and are arguably still the best place to go for community, learning, and information sharing.

Facebook are even losing the like/follow game, to twitter and Instagram. Facebook is pretty much a bunch of "personal" forums not unlike what livejournal was, combined with what MSN messenger was. And then some company pages with wildly varying degrees of activity.

spudmunkey wrote:
gumbynotpokey wrote:Yeah, and it has SO many people and moves so QUICK.


My biggest beef is that there's no archive. I think about once a week, someone posts about SD multiscale pickups, the screw-sticking-out vader bridge question, if Satin will gloss over time, etc. With no way to search or even browse subtopics, it has to start the whole conversation over again.

Kind of funny is that Jeff addresses many of those common questions, at least every other week. Sometimes every week. But, it seems many people aren't even aware of the videos/live streams. People who are don't always watch them. And Facebook mobile basically does everything it can, to keep you from finding video sections. Even your very own videos. On top of that, good luck finding something you posted last month. In this age of "everything is searchable" they are missing the ball by a mile. I agree.

Facebook is pretty bad, really. My only use for it is to keep in touch with some key people and to follow local events at bars and whatnot. I have less than 100 FB friends, its pretty tightly curated.

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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby Casual Madman » Thu Nov 30, 2017 8:52 am

Toptube wrote:Forums never died and are arguably still the best place to go for community, learning, and information sharing.


Maybe it's just my experience to have frequented forums like this one, with a really committed but very small user base. An absolutely lovely writers' group I once frequented was killed by its associated publisher for lack of traffic - it had probably a few more regular posters than this one.

:(

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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby Doctor Doug » Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:00 pm

spudmunkey wrote:
Doctor Doug wrote:Really? I get that you're curious but are you actually going to read responses from 50, 000 people?


Do you mind if I paste that reply the next time that question comes up? I can credit your user name if you'd like. H :laughhard:


Feel free. No need to credit me. lol

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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby Bob77 » Wed Dec 20, 2017 7:24 am

Regardless of size and some of the other things highlighted above, my primary issue with this forum over the years is the lack of objective criticism on these instruments and the excessively negative blanket statements on other brands.

It is really helpful when people can look at an instrument objectively without being in a honey fantasy and speak to both the strengths and weaknesses of it. This is what gives new potential buyers the most accurate information about what it is they are getting into.

But the culture of this forum is to all be a love feast, which is understandable since the company owns it :mrgreen:
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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby EL_SUPER_BEASTO » Wed Dec 20, 2017 12:51 pm

I found that to really be true 5-6 years ago when I was doing the guitar forum thing a lot more. Nowadays I don't see a lot of kool-aid drinking going on here, but over on the FB group there's a lot of pretty juvenile anecdotes and assertions from both sides. You have a lot of the loyalists against the goons, and they both hate the realists which I think have spilled over or decided to mostly reside here anymore because of it.
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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby gumbynotpokey » Wed Dec 20, 2017 1:05 pm

Mario Sangermano and Spud helping me spec out the beloved Claro fretless was worth the price of admission to the BBS for me. If you know what I mean. I mean, they were SO critical to what it became.

claro BEM 1.jpg


claro fretless.jpg


claro neck.jpg


A member (was it Coda?) first pointing out she made the catalog was amazing.

claro catalog.jpg


And then Evster (where u be, man?) making this for the thread really was cool.

claro gumby.jpg


My point is that thread development like spec'ing over days/weeks, and catalog and photoshop stuff improves WITH TIME. Over on FB, there is zero time to develop anything.

Sorry, BBS, carry on.
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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby EL_SUPER_BEASTO » Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:51 pm

I know of that Mario, saw him calling someone an amateur and boasting about how he works in the music business just the other day on FB. Maybe he was having a bad day, we all do, but that's probably the most common of the types obviously endemic to Kiesel FB group.
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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby brento73 » Thu Dec 21, 2017 4:58 am

EL_SUPER_BEASTO wrote:I know of that Mario, saw him calling someone an amateur and boasting about how he works in the music business just the other day on FB. Maybe he was having a bad day, we all do, but that's probably the most common of the types obviously endemic to Kiesel FB group.


I'm not sure if I know Mario(who may very well work in/with music), but a few years ago I was on another forum, and someone was always talking about how they were a big-time producer and had worked with all of these famous bands. Then, they didn't understand what overdubbing was. Like, specifically, couldn't believe that the lead vocals and backing vocals on a song were all sung by the same person. Since that time, I'm skeptical of who and what anyone claims to be until I see some evidence to support it :)

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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby EL_SUPER_BEASTO » Thu Dec 21, 2017 11:19 am

People are both good and bad, like I said maybe he was just having an off day. I don't have interest in frying anyone specifically, but the spicy apologists get under my skin sometimes. It's still pretty obvious when someone isn't being realistic one way or the other, it's always the people that just want to complain or alternately gush about how Kiesel/Brand X is the last word in guitars. Kiesel makes my favorite guitars, but I can go down to the pawn shop and buy a guitar for $150 that's arguably just as good as any other guitar for all intents and purposes, so I try to keep my shirt on when talking about brands.
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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby Bob77 » Thu Dec 21, 2017 5:04 pm

EL_SUPER_BEASTO wrote:I found that to really be true 5-6 years ago when I was doing the guitar forum thing a lot more. Nowadays I don't see a lot of kool-aid drinking going on here, but over on the FB group there's a lot of pretty juvenile anecdotes and assertions from both sides. You have a lot of the loyalists against the goons, and they both hate the realists which I think have spilled over or decided to mostly reside here anymore because of it.


I see the kool-aid drinking still. But you are right...maybe not as much as before.

These are good instruments, and you get a ton of value for the money. But there are so many good guitars out there these days also. Things have really changed for the better I think.
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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby spudmunkey » Thu Dec 21, 2017 5:26 pm

The entire market has changed, so Kiesel/Carvin has changed with it. Years ago, almost anything not made in the US, certain parts of europe, or Japan was garbage 99% of the time. If you wanted anything of even passable quality, you had to pay.

Now, however, not only are places like Korea, Indonesia and China capable of making decently high-quality stuff (I would have put a specific Korean Schecter in my local GC up against any other instrument i the store at any price), but also, a $200 guitar years ago would have come with pre-corroded frets, an MDF body, and pickups seemingly designed to be microphones rather than pickups. Now, that $200, which is technically worth less now due to inflation, can actually get something playable. Hell, I just bought an Ibanez bass for $177 (including California sales tax!) and it's better than some of the guitars I had growing up that cost more than double that, even back in the late 80s and 90s. And with the explosion of the internet, everyone has instant information about anything, so it's easy for someone to just make a decision based on price, and how something looks in a photo. I don't know if it still does this, but I used to open the Amazon app in a store, scan the barcode of a random product, and it would show me the price of that exact item. I'd sometimes have the item ordered from my phone before I got to my car to leave the store.

To stand out, you either have to scream "Value!" which is hard to do competing against the low-price but passably functional imports, or scream "We're unique!" by offering products or options no one else does, especially for the value. I think the tightrope Kiesel walks between those two worlds is getting thinner and thinner as any Tom, d*ck or Mary can start their own guitar company with guitars all coming out of the same Korean factories at seemingly similar quality levels, equipment (SD pickups, Hipshot bridges, etc etc), and pricing, so because there's so many companies making similar products in the same places, you end up with enough variation that it's *almost* like getting to pick some custom options, in a way.

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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby ElfDude » Thu Dec 21, 2017 9:32 pm

Tom, who, or Mary? :lol:
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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby spudmunkey » Thu Dec 21, 2017 10:20 pm

ElfDude wrote:Tom, who, or Mary? :lol:


Image

:lol:

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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby Bob77 » Fri Dec 22, 2017 6:28 am

@spudmonkey

Well said!

It's really a whole different world when it comes to the availability of quality instruments available that we did not have back in the day. And it is true that many of these overseas guitars come from the same places. Many I'll start my own guitar company :mrgreen:
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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby Doctor Turn » Fri Dec 22, 2017 1:30 pm

ElfDude wrote:Tom, who, or Mary? :lol:


On the thread for Canon mutants sci fi, I couldn't even write the name of the classic writer, Philip K d*ck. :lol:

What is this site run by Quakers? Amish luthiery? :shh:
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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby spudmunkey » Fri Dec 22, 2017 1:43 pm

Their print catalogs used to have a bible verse referenced in every issue... :D

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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby Doctor Turn » Fri Dec 22, 2017 3:07 pm

Then let us pray for Alnico II PAF style pickups and P90s.

Image
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1985 DC150K (koa) Stereo, M22N/M22SD w/black hardware.
1985 100 Watt X Amp 2 x 12 combo (XV212) upgraded w/ 2 Vintage 30's
...and other gear.

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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby Omsong » Fri Dec 22, 2017 6:49 pm

...till H@ll freezes over. :lol:
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Re: Kiesel Random Thoughts (not worth their own thread)

Postby ElfDude » Fri Dec 22, 2017 7:57 pm

spudmunkey wrote:Their print catalogs used to have a bible verse referenced in every issue... :D


I liked that.
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