Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

USA Custom Shop Acoustic and Electric Guitars

Moderators: Kevio, ElfDude, JesseM, RockCrue, soundchick, ChrisH, peb, Mike Jones, Bundy

User avatar
speedyone
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 298
Joined: Feb 2008

Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby speedyone » Sat Jan 06, 2018 10:28 am

Hi everyone,

I’m looking to get a Kiesel, having had a number of Carvins in the past — DC127, DC727, H2, HH2

I HATED the J-Custom trem I had.

It seems the new Kiesel/Hipshot trem is much superior.

However, I couldn’t bond with my headless guitar; despite using 008 gauge strings, the bends still felt stiff up at the higher numbered frets. I wonder if that was somehow related to the crappy J-Custom trem?

Anyhow, I was thinking of getting another Carvin/Kiesel, and I noticed that the new Kiesel/Hipshot tremolo is available on the builder for guitar models with headstocks. Is this true, or is it a mistake in the builder? If you CAN get a trem on models with headstocks, how would that work— fine tuners still at the bottom, but using regular tuners at the headstock?

Thanks to anyone who can address these questions!!

:)

User avatar
spudmunkey
Elite Carvinite
Elite Carvinite
Posts: 16167
Joined: Jan 2008
Location: San Francisco Bay Area

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby spudmunkey » Sat Jan 06, 2018 10:50 am

The version available for guitars with headstocks is essentially a Hipshot Contour with a different (supposedly more Floyd-like) arm and block.

The headless guitar version of it with tuners is a variation of the Contour, and isn't available on models with headstocks. :)

Like this:
Image

Image

User avatar
speedyone
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 298
Joined: Feb 2008

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby speedyone » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:02 am

...and now I'm more confused, as during a google search I found a link to the Kiesel/Hipshot being a replacement for the Wilkinson bridge, and it looks pretty much like a vintage trem (only using ball-bearings).

So, apparently there are TWO new Kiesel/Hipshot trems? One that is more vintage looking, and another that is more like a Strandberg with fine tuners?

User avatar
speedyone
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 298
Joined: Feb 2008

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby speedyone » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:03 am

Sorry, posted my 2nd post seconds after you replied Spudmunky!

So the new headless bridge is the one on the Vader, got it.

User avatar
spudmunkey
Elite Carvinite
Elite Carvinite
Posts: 16167
Joined: Jan 2008
Location: San Francisco Bay Area

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby spudmunkey » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:07 am

[Edit]ha, typed this one as you posted that one, but I'll leave it here anyway

No. Keisel doesn't have any ball bearing trems. The Hipshot Contour that is the basis of both of Kiesel's trems use a bearing function, but not b balls. Both of Kiesel's Bridges are basically Hipshot Contours.

Hipshot also makes Bridges that look more "vintage", but Kiesel doesn't offer those. And by "replacement for the Wilkinson", it's not a drop in replacement, but more of a "taking the Wilkinson's place in the lineup of a modern, not-locking floating trems" meaning of "replacement".
Last edited by spudmunkey on Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
speedyone
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 298
Joined: Feb 2008

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby speedyone » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:08 am

Yeah, I'll probably not get any guitars with the Contour style trem.

I had a custom 7 built by a master luthier years ago, and honestly, though the Hipshot Contour FELT smooth and was great to use, it didn't hold tune any better than my typical USA Strat trems did.

I'm so annoyed with going out of tune, I even installed an Evertune bridge on one of my Strats, but it hasn't lived up to the hype.... it still goes out of tune.

I guesss I'll stick with Floyds.

I tried to do a youtube search for the new trem on the Vader model, but surprisingly, NO ONE has any vids playing a simple chord AFTER doing trem abuse to show if it can return to pitch!

My ultimate guitar would be an original H2 with a locking trem.

User avatar
speedyone
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 298
Joined: Feb 2008

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby speedyone » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:09 am

Thanks much for the info!!!

:D

User avatar
speedyone
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 298
Joined: Feb 2008

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby speedyone » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:19 am

Hmmmm... now that the wilky is being replaced by the Kiesel Hipshot, I MAY consider getting another H2; I LOVED the one I had, although it was a fixed bridge I had bought used on ebay. I just wished it had a trem.

Though using the Frudua tuning method and "dumping the bar" after doing big string bends is kind of a hassle, I could then get my dream guitar of an original Holdsworth with a trem.

I think that's what I may do

:think:

Thanks again for your info!

User avatar
spudmunkey
Elite Carvinite
Elite Carvinite
Posts: 16167
Joined: Jan 2008
Location: San Francisco Bay Area

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby spudmunkey » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:21 am

Note that *some* of the older models haven't yet been updated to the new bridge like the Bolt and suppressing the new GH3 (it does indeed take slightly different routing than they Wilky or the Vintage trem), so it may not be as easy as just clock click clicking on the web.

User avatar
speedyone
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 298
Joined: Feb 2008

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby speedyone » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:37 am

You know what..... Floyd rose has the new rail-tail system, dive-only that seems pretty stable.

Curious if that would be able to fit in the routing cavity used by the newer Kiesel Hipshot without any modification, as it says its a drop-in replacement for vintage style trems.

User avatar
speedyone
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 298
Joined: Feb 2008

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby speedyone » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:38 am

Just read your post, ok. I understand.

User avatar
speedyone
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 298
Joined: Feb 2008

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby speedyone » Sat Jan 06, 2018 11:55 am

Holy crap!! I just discovered that Floy Rose makes a new FLAT MOUNT locking trem as a drop-in replacement for tune-a-matic style bridges!!!!

Yesssssss!!!!!


Now I CAN get an original Holdsworth with the tune-o-matic bridge and drop-in the Floyd!!!!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVjMrFbNhGg

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D

User avatar
spudmunkey
Elite Carvinite
Elite Carvinite
Posts: 16167
Joined: Jan 2008
Location: San Francisco Bay Area

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby spudmunkey » Sat Jan 06, 2018 12:36 pm

Make sure it will fit. I believe, and I may be wrong, that Kiesel's tune-o-matic bridge uses a different stud spacing than a "Gibson Les Paul" spacing, so you'll want to double check that it will fit.

User avatar
speedyone
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 298
Joined: Feb 2008

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby speedyone » Sat Jan 06, 2018 2:00 pm

Yeah, the Floyd Rose website shows the bridge’s exact dimensions, so I’ll send Albert a copy to see if it’s doable. Can’t wait!!!!!

Rialas
Gold Member
Gold Member
Posts: 105
Joined: Apr 2017

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby Rialas » Sat Jan 06, 2018 3:54 pm

speedyone wrote:Yeah, I'll probably not get any guitars with the Contour style trem.

I had a custom 7 built by a master luthier years ago, and honestly, though the Hipshot Contour FELT smooth and was great to use, it didn't hold tune any better than my typical USA Strat trems did.

I'm so annoyed with going out of tune, I even installed an Evertune bridge on one of my Strats, but it hasn't lived up to the hype.... it still goes out of tune.

I guesss I'll stick with Floyds.

I tried to do a youtube search for the new trem on the Vader model, but surprisingly, NO ONE has any vids playing a simple chord AFTER doing trem abuse to show if it can return to pitch!

My ultimate guitar would be an original H2 with a locking trem.

My 5 month old HH2 with hipshot trem wouldn't stay in tune either until I lubricated the nut. To my surprise, completely solved the problem.

User avatar
amon
Gold Carvinite
Gold Carvinite
Posts: 1095
Joined: Oct 2012

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby amon » Sat Jan 06, 2018 7:12 pm

speedyone wrote:Now I CAN get an original Holdsworth with the tune-o-matic bridge and drop-in the Floyd!!!!

Kiesel drops their ToM into a recessed channel in order to use a straight neck joint angle. The FRX is designed to fit a Gibson-style angled neck joint. I doubt you could get the bridge low enough to work with Kiesel's setup.

User avatar
speedyone
Platinum Member
Platinum Member
Posts: 298
Joined: Feb 2008

Re: Hipshot/Kiesel trem available on models with headstocks?!

Postby speedyone » Sun Jan 07, 2018 7:54 am

My original Holdsworth H2 didn’t have a recessed channel. But, I’ll send the bridge specs to Kiesel’s head tech to see what he says. :)


Return to Kiesel Guitars / Carvin Guitars

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests